Do you enjoy listening to podcasts? Perhaps while walking the dog, working out at the gym, or wading through mindless tasks such as raking leaves? If so, you are not alone. Interest in podcasts is growing exponentially, and production of podcasts is now big business. Well, it turns out that you can now enjoy a few Macfilos articles in podcast format. It’s all the work of an incredible new Google product called NotebookLM.
The experience of complete disbelief at the latest jaw-dropping capabilities of machine learning-based AI systems has been termed ‘AI vertigo’. I experienced this sensation myself when first trying DALLE-2, and again when trying out ChatGPT. How could a machine interpret a string of text as a never-seen-before image? And how, on demand, could a machine provide a concise, coherent synopsis of a long-winded article describing a sophisticated concept?
Well, I just experienced another bout of AI vertigo. While listening to the New York Times’s tech podcast, I learned of a new Google product called NotebookLM. It is based on Google’s Gemini 1.5 Pro Large Language Model. The presenters discussed the app with one of its creators. In summary, NotebookLM allows users to upload a trove of material on a subject of interest, and then pose the system queries about that material.
A new way to archive information and then interrogate it
Imagine being able to upload all 27 M-Files articles, and then ask for an overview of the best 3rd-party 28mm lenses for M-Mount cameras? Or, why not upload the entire 6,000 article Macfilos archive, and query the system about the progression of capabilities in Leica M-cameras over time?
Get the idea?
But, the killer option offered by NotebookLM, the one that induced my AI vertigo, was to present the output material as a podcast. That’s right. The system can ingest an article, extract its major themes, synthesize a dialogue based on these themes, and then generate an audio conversation about it between two people.
It is truly incredible.
Hearing is believing
To illustrate NotebookLM in action, I have two examples for you. In each case, I uploaded an article of mine that was previously posted on Macfilos.
The first was: Prioritizing Weight Over Speed: Is this the latest fashion in lens design? Here is a link to the article. And here is where you can listen to the podcast:
Brainy neural networks

The second example was: Photography and Brain Health: Ten ways to keep those neurons in tip-top shape. Here is a link to the article. And here is where you can listen to the podcast:
For each article, two non-existent people, male and female, discuss the contents.
The speakers have convincing American accents, but in addition, by design, they use the intonations, emphases, pauses, and repetition of ‘like’ that human podcasters do.
Their conversation is upbeat and enthusiastic, again, by design.
Podcasts are a great way of absorbing information, or exploring the issues associated with a contentious topic. But, a photography podcast has one major drawback: you can’t look at the photographs!
So, fear not, we won’t be posting every article to be found on Macfilos as a podcast. We might not even post any others beyond this article. But we thought you would enjoy learning about this new Google product, and sampling its capabilities in the context of your favourite photography blog.
Coincidentally, The 2024 Nobel Prize for Physics was awarded yesterday to two pioneers of machine learning. Geoffrey Hinton and John Hopfield were awarded the prize for their contributions to the formulation of neural networks, the basis for the revolution in artificial we are experiencing. I suspect they never imagined their research would lead eventually to a Macfilos podcast…
Please let us know what you think in the comments, especially if you experienced a twinge of vertigo…
A cup of coffee works wonders in supporting Macfilos
Did you know that Macfilos is run by a dedicated team of volunteers? We rely on donations to help pay our running costs. And even the cost of a cup of coffee will do wonders for our energy levels.
As someone with eye strain issues, I welcome the podcasts. Cheery is ok by me!
Hello Keith, and thank you for bringing me up to speed on how AI might bring a new dimension to Macfilos. The field is certainly developing very fast.
Yes, the enthusiasm of those current AI voices does begin to weigh heavily after a while, but it’s intriguing to consider how the system will evolve. A next step, following rapid learning of voice recognition, will be for Macfilos podcasts to be presented in the dulcet tones of our Uber-editor Michael Evans (or maybe Yourself, or Jörg-Peter, or maybe even Jason Murray indeed). Just feed it some text and you will be “talking” to us. I’ll listen to that Gang of Four as I weekly drive the M1 to and from Sydney.
Made me think of Dylan Thomas’ line: “books that told me everything about the wasp, except why”
I am glad everyone enjoyed this effort to highlight these amazing advances in artificial intelligence!
People like to absorb information in different ways, and podcasts appeal to people who enjoy listening as much as reading. They also allow people to multitask, as mentioned. Being able to automatically convert a written document into an audio conversation between two people, is a remarkable achievement.
The enthusiastic presenters, with their faux bonhomie, might not be everyone cup of tea, but for anyone who listens to US-based podcasts (where, incredibly, presenters speak in American accents!) these examples sound just like podcasts you could hear today. In fact, the presenters sound like real Americans, just like the majority of Macfilos readers!
Perhaps, in due course, we will be able to instruct NotebookLM to generate the podcast in the voices of Peter Cook and Dudley Moore, or Jimmy Tarbuck and Harry Secombe. It’s probably just a matter of time…
Apologies to younger readers for these obscure references.
As well-supported as Macfilos is, the world is moving on, particularly with regard to what ‘younger’ consumers are looking for. No-one should be resting on their laurels. Instead, it’s better to adapt, and move with the times. Otherwise, you know what happened to the dinosaurs…
Cheers!
Keith
Yuk, they are hideous. The awful voices and accents and the false bonhomie.Way OTT. I expected them to sign off by telling me to have a good day. Thank goodness they weren’t expecting me to tip them.
Lots of better things to do with my time. And I’m very lucky. I can read.
I think you are all missing the point. Try looking at the wood instead of complaining about the trees. The mere fact that this is possible is a triumph of technology. A few years ago, this would have been all science fantasy. It’s not what is said, or how it is said, it is the fact that it can be said. All credit to Keith James for highlighting the latest developments,
That said, I do have my reservations about what is in store as AI becomes ever more competent. Soon we will face an intelligence that is greater than human capability, and who knows where that will lead. This could become one of the greatest risks to humanity.
Alan,
You’ve said that it’s great. And then you say that it “..could become one of the greatest risks to humanity”.
So which is it: terrific or terrible? ..I don’t think it can be both ..do you? Who’s not seeing the wood for the trees?
Yours respectfully,
– David.
I do not like the wood or the trees. I like to read and pause often and absorb or ponder things so I do not miss the point.
David,
The current developments in AI are astounding and, if used sensibly, are indeed great. But when I wrote the comment, I had in mind the words of this year’s Nobel Prize winner, Professor Geoffrey Hinton. He is considered to be the “godfather of AI”. The world is reaching a pivotal moment, he says, and it is very reasonable for people to be worrying about these issues now. While we can marvel at AI, and discuss side issues such as this podcast system, it does not stop us fearing that we are developing a form of intelligence that may one day be turned against up.
This sounds like the depressing scenario of every science fiction movie of the past ten years but this path is not inevitable and we are not necessarily going to be doomed by a ‘superior’ intelligence just because it’s the popular mindset of the moment and a James Cameron movie from 1984. The resistance has already started. It’s autumn now and I’ve been enjoying the sound of crispy leaves underfoot and the natural sounds of the great outdoors instead of listening to AI generated podcasts. For me, technology is something that’s just there, whether I like it or not, but I’m not dazzled by it or obsessed with AI to call it “a triumph of technology”.
“The Macfilos Podcast: You heard it here first.”
So when do we expect the first Macfilos VIDEO Podcast with smiling and knowledgeable presenters from across the Macfilos globe?
Ugh ..hideous!
The content is useful and handy, but the voices ..aaarrrrgghh! Maybe they’d be better in English, rather than American. But all that false bonhomie gets so tiring to listen to ..for this Englishman, anyway.
We’ll soon be in the Matrix (..name of a film, Brian..) in which all experience is artificial, including photos, video and speech. At least, I-I-I-I-ah-ah-ah.. (sorry; glitsch ..gl-glitch ..black cat pass-ss-ssing by..) ..I’m s-sorry Dave, I can’t open the pod bay doors.. battery r-r-running low..
“False bonhomie” (which I normally think of as “spurious bonhomie”) does sum this up. Or should it be up this sum I will not put? They couldn’t sound more enthusiastic if they tried. Sounds like the content of the podcast (not the excellent wind knitting surrounding it) is failing to stir enthusiasm in Dublin and west London. Must be the weather.
No thanks, Keith. With the greatest of respect, the fun in photography or writing is in doing it yourself. Adding so-called AI elements just destroys all the fun. As for those ‘podcasts’, the annoying voices had me switching off within seconds. I’d love to know what my fellow ‘Old World’ person Mike thinks about all of this? A big thumbs down to AI, ChatGPT, NotebookLM etc, etc. Maybe this makes sense in sunny California, but in Dublin on a damp October day it just sounds plain ridiculous. How does it all sound in sunny Chiswick, Mike?
William
Well… I agree with you on the voices, and I did tentatively suggest we ought to have a British (or Irish) voice. Ideally, you would choose the language before listening. This AI-generated discussion has a long way to go, but it is already disconcertingly authentic. Some podcasters do sound like that. But full marks to Keith for being at the cutting edge of technology on our behalf.
Hi William, I fully 100% agree with you. I am not sure Mike or anyone else with get my dry sense of humour in my first remark. However, I do not mind if other people are interested but I have 0% interest. I guess I am old school.
I have the same problem with podcast that I have with videos. Unlike a written article I cannot scan the article to find the bit that’s relevant to me. So I don’t bother with any of it. This applies to my share trading platform as much as it applies to YouTube and podcasts equally.
Life is too short to watch an entire video or listen to an entire podcast to glean the few nuggets of information that I want.
That and the voices made me turn off after about 5 seconds…
what is a podcast? Sounds like video.
I listen to a podcast: The Archers, an everyday story of countryfolk. I heard the first episode while sitting on my grandmother’s lap, and it’s been going ever since. If course, this was on “the wireless” and podcasts were not a hot topic of discussion.